Buying a good 80s bike as an investment?

Al3xander

Dirt Disciple
Just a general question from a retro novice, as I'm thinking of buying one or maybe two quality oldish bikes (to ride, not hang on a wall) but am having trouble talking myself into it.

From looking around over recent months, for around £1,000, seems I could buy a complete 80s Pinarello, Bianchi, Colnago, Gios, etc, that's in very good nick. Today, for example, a gorgeous Merckx (De Rosa frame, Campy Super Record, superb condition) has just turned up in the For Sale section here.

Are all quality bikes like this going up or down in value these days, or only some makes / frames, or none at all? I'd find it a lot easier to pull the trigger on one if a couple of folks said 'yeah, they are', so thought I'd ask.

Thanks,
A
 
I'd say it depends on the rarity of the bike AND the quality and availability of the parts that are on it?

However, I'm still a newb to this as well! But that's just what I can gather from what sells on the forum.
 
Hello, here's my thoughts on this, based on doing this for a couple of years now.

1) The only way to really make an investment in the sense of making a decent profit is to buy stuff cheap from people who really don't know or care what they have and sell it to people who really want it.
It is fairly hard work to accumulate the knowledge about what is good, find people who have stuff they just want to get rid of, and sell it to people who want it. The fairy stories about people buying a Colnago Mexico for €10 from their local tip happen but they are very rare.

2) Old 'retro' classic bikes DO seem to keep their value quite well at the moment. If you buy a new bike it will automatically lose at least 30% of its value if you try to sell it. If you buy an older bike it should be possible to get more of your money back if you decide to sell.
However, there is a growing trend for retro stuff at the moment. It seems it started with fixies and people are now rediscovering classic and retro bikes. Whether this lasts is open to question - in a year or two people might have lost interest, or retro bikes could become as established as vintage cars. Nobody knows for sure, so 'investing' is a gamble.

3) To be honest, I think you will have more fun if you just try to find stuff you like and enjoy riding, try to only pay what you can afford, and look after it as best you can. I have gradually accumulated a small collection of bikes I like and have no intention of selling, and didn't pay ridiculous prices for - I find that more fun than trying to make a huge profit.

Sorry, I went on there a bit, but maybe it's helpful.

Johnny
 
Investment?

Depends how you define an investment :D .

You are talking about spending money on classic bikes...my view is this (simplified as I've touched on this before on RetroBike).

There is a demographic issue at play here...younger enthusiasts tend to prefer the quasi sexy foreign (i.e not English) bikes - I think there's a lot of fashion driving this, and fashions die as quickly as they arrive. Older members, who've probably been into decent bikes since boyhood tend to either have the desirable bikes already, or, want to buy the bike they desired when young but sold or couldn't afford.

I'll give a personal example: Raleigh SBDU frames are now highly desirable(they were in the day). I bought one from the SBDU in the 1980s it is built with top end components of the day and it is both desirable and collectable today-these two things aren't always compatible. The bikes that I think will always be desirable and less subject to the vagaries of fashion are the English/British frames from the top quality builders of the day and today - Chas Roberts is an excellent example.

Bikes as fashion, if my suspicion is correct then these bikes will change hands many times, probably be stripped for their components by traders, and they'll gradually disappear and fall into disrepair as many fashion followers will not have the funds to restore and rebuild them.

I also find it difficult to imagine most of the mass produced"white good made in China"bicycles (whatever the brand transfers are) being either desirable or collectable once they become old.

The corollary of this is, you either buy a bike you currently wouldn't consider, as it would probably be older than you. Or you invest in a handbuilt frame from someone like Chas Roberts, build it with the best you can afford and go and RIDE IT. A bike built for you would be a great investment in your pleasure over a long period and you'll have the satisfaction of having something unique - instead of follwing fashion. All cyclists are secretly jealous of those who've got a bespoke frame.

I am not a collector, and you have to probably ask yourself am I a rider - really?

Hope this helps.

Roadking.
 
Thanks guys for taking the time to reply - much appreciated.

Don't worry, 'investment' is probably the wrong choice of word, and maybe a result of me looking into moving some savings around and a chat with my bank on Monday. I'm not looking to buy anything with a view to selling it on - it would just make it easier for me to buy something if I knew prices were on the up, that's all. For example, even though they're getting expensive, I still buy new vinyl records. Though I wouldn't ever think of getting rid of hardly any of them, it's good to know many are almost immediately worth more than I paid for them.

Johnny and Roadking, you've neatly summed up many of the thoughts I already had. To be honest, I'm struggling to tell what's a good buy, and though I'd love something like a Holdsworth, I'm probably looking more for the more fashionable (and not such good value?) European makes. Thing is, I don't have the know how to build up a real labour of love - and thanks partly to the fixie boom and a resurgent interest in older bikes in general, the prices for NOS Campagnolo, Turbo saddles, and so on, are pretty steep anyhow!

Bottom line is, I just want to get a quality bike I can enjoy riding from the off, and take it from there.

Thanks,
A
 
I guess the best approach is to try and buy something that is at least proof against depreciation.
10 years ago I bought a 1994 Lynskey-made Litespeed and equipped it witht 1996 Chorus and Record bits. Note that this stuff was merely 'obsolete' at the time, not classic.

Probably I'd get almost all my money back today, which I reckon makes it a good deal for 10 years riding. I did have to spend £1.10 on new pawls for the shifters last year, plus a new chain or two.

I would suggest buying merely ageing stuff from the best builders / components.

Something I would suggest fits that bill today would be a Look KG frame (early Carbon fibre) and early 10 speed Campag Record (with square taper BB). Personally I'd avoid Shimano simply because the shifters are not rebuildable and likely to present a problem someday in the future.
 
Hi Alex :-) RK has covered this very well, and if you read it a few times, it''ll sink in better. "It's hard to explain nostalgia to a generation living in the here & now". John, DB & Hamster also fill in the blanks that RK hasn't covered.

Nostalgia is really what it's all about, you know, memories of riding a certain bike at certain times in your life OR as RK says, looking back on your life when you're our age and realising that you can now afford the dream bike you always wanted.

I recall reading a story from a younger rider on a forum once about inheriting a "metal bike" from someone and wondering if the old shed was of any use at all as decent road bike. The guy knew his stuff about bikes in general, but only from his own carbon fibre era. In short he was mocking the quality of the steel bike. It was a Paganini kitted in Campagnolo.

He tweaked it back to health over many posts, and finally got to ride it, apprehensively I add. His next post after the ride made me smile like a twit. "Superb, surprisingly smooth & fast, comfortable, effortless" He gushed for several posts. The last thing I read of his was "Converted". He found not only the courage to give the bike an unbiased chance to impress, but the honesty to admit it was seriously good, so good he now preferred it over his carbon job. It's a true story I swear ... It's out there somewhere.

Myself, "I ride a Faggin with full Campagnolo 1988 Chorus Groupset". I have others now, many others, all bought in this recent boom, all excellent, all investments of sort because they are true 1'offs. There are NO others like them out there OR very few in top condition. Put it this way, " upto 1990 at least, the vast majority of quality bikes where Hand Built, as in, hand built by a specialist frame builder who had learnt his trade of many many decades of building. Thats just the frame. Imagine a guy, standing for days at a work bench hand polishing lugs so they are a "perfect fit", then assembling all the tubes etc in a jig, ready for brasing. It was a complex & precise task to make perfect frames, that took not just skill, but great skill and dedication.

I've had my Faggin since 1984, I bought her in Hamburg when I lived there through the 80's depression in Britain ( I was there from 1981-1986 ). I bought it from the Von Hacht brothers (when they where just a tiny little cornershop). I rode with these guys several times, turns out they weren't just bikeshop guys who liked to ride but world champions, each in their own right. I wanted a Colnago, but they insisted the Faggin was the better build despite its name being less well known. Colnago where churning out bikes hand over fist in 1984, and they knew it. Faggin where still trying to survive in a cut throat market.

I have ridden that bike for over 70,000 miles (more like 100,000), never a hitch, glitch, nothing ever went wrong with it bar a puncture every now and again. Thats it. I've never & I mean never, stripped and re-greased because it has never needed it, not once. It got a refit in 1989 at a shop called Keith Coppells of Maghull Liverpool. His handywork is what I ride now, same frame, newer groupset, immaculate ride. I've hammered this bike, treated it like a Shirehorse pulling a barge, throw her over walls, snow, rain, sun, wind, yet still she runs like a dream. Not a bad investment of £1000 for a bike that still whups carbon stuff regualrly.

Steel is a smoother ride. So Alex, I could happily tell stories all day long about where my bike has been with me, Switzerland, Germany, Jersey, Britain, but the end point would be "she has never let me down, not a single once". It's 1 and only failure was the 12 teeth rear cog shattering on a hill in Jersey, but thats god damn Campag copy merchants Shimano for you.

Buy 1 Alex, ride it for a while, then find out what the hell it is, who made it and why you love it so much. The journey will leave you amazed, informed, but definately hooked, then addicted, then it'll be "welcome to bike addicts club". Final note "my nephew has a £2000 carbon job and it looks very cool, rides like a dream, is fast, solid, but for my mind uncomfortable on long haul. It's just 3 years old. Lets see what its like to ride in another 25years, lets see if his Shimano bla bla hubs are still smooth after 70,000 miles. I think you know what I'm saying Alex, "its like the first time you meet the right woman, you swear you won't let het get under your skin, tie you down etc, but after 30years marriage you realise she's the only thing in your life thats been there throughout, knows the bumps and twists, but stayed solid & relaible. This is what It's like to own a bike for so long, thats why they are She's not he's, because they become a part of you, an extension of what you are in this world. Later buddy, I'm rambling now, but that's bikes for you "the only love affair you are allowed whilst still married". Yours Laz.
 
Epic posts. There is something to be said for going for something obscure; many countries had great bike road bike builders and some research during the journey can be rewarding.
 
To understand Alex, here is a fine example of money being the driving force behind a sale, instead of the actual article being sold as a valuable collectors piece. A Genuine 753 Ti Raleigh has been completely destroyed for a nickle & a dime. It makes me so sad. Each time someone gets their hands on 1 of these and destroys it, there is simply 1 less to find. It doesn't make those still left in the world anymore valuable persay, just simply takes another 1 out the picture.

If you read his listing, the bike has been broken into parts, parts that are already awash on Ebay. I saw an unused NOS Hetchins Magnum Opus go last year from Wigan the same way, broken into 50th Anniversary parts & a frame. HE made a few hundred quid less than 2 grand, yet IMHO the bike in its "original state" (don't forget when a bike is built from NOS it has no scratches / paint chips from parts removal ) was worth every penny of £5,000+. As far as I'm concerned what I saw was a criminal offence, destruction of a very valuable piece of cycling history. It was built for someone very important and never used, not once. It's gone now, forever, so someone can source bits & pieces of mishmash Campagnolo to make it right again. If I hade a grand spare, I'd buy the Ti 753, but only if they had left it in 1 piece :-) Later buddy, yours Laz.

This is it currently on Ebay

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Raleigh-Team- ... 3cc2ab6ad7
 
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